Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. This can be done with moar boosters or more calculated wing and body design, depending on the aero model you use. i dont know what kind of range youre looking for but i would make a significantly smaller plane. 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. Learn more about Stack Overflow the company, and our products. Ok, the panther engine is still not good enough. Powered by Invision Community. FAR is supposed to take aspect into account, but I'm not very experienced with it and cannot advice you as to how it works. Editing Kerbal Space Program save files for KSO, Rasterpropmonitor for Kerbal Space Program. Imagine that first plane but with the bubble cockpit and the old style round intakes. With some fins to keep you stable and careful aim, you can hit your desired location and altitude and will have 5-10 seconds to collect data before you hurtle past it and pull your chute. You will find that when you're flying around, will always be slightly below the crosshairs on the navball. Not only does it conk out at high altitudes, but also it conks out at high speeds, and you need to be able to go fast to fly up high. One problem is i'm running stock on career mode and only have 30 part to spare, so large planes are out of the question. I was generally under the impression that basic jets were mostly deadweight on high-performance aircraft: while they are superior for low-speed, low-altitude operations, they become deadweight at hypersonic velocities. surface of jool. I'm in career mode (have the turbofan engine) and trying to get some science readings for a mission at a high altitude. Remembering the FW TA152 and the U2 I put long wings on it and while its turn rate makes an airliner look like a fighter plane it is stable enough at 19000m. This means it is better to have excessive amounts of oxygen than not to. In KSP2, you are a rocket scientist who must build and test rockets, spaceships, and planes. AoA itself refers to the angle of the wing (or the whole plane if the AoI is 0)relative to the airflow. The Rapier, for example, works great as a high-altitude engine, precisely because it can go so fast. Rationale: If that's all a case of Too Many Words, think of it this way: Suppose you just build a plane the "default" way and don't put any AoA at all on the wings. The Kerbal Space Program subreddit. Which makes this engine ideal for those missions which require doing many science activities above particular altitudes. Also, while you mentioned the TJs most efficient altitude is ~ 5km (I'm not sure, but lets assume it's true), you need to realize that the drag you're getting at that altitude is going to wreck any efficiency gains. This thread is quite old. - "In Space High" means your craft is inside the given Sphere of Influence and above the "Space Border" altitude listed in the Celestial Body Multiplier Matrix. 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. Make sure we're on the same page with terminology. Incidentally, for these speeds and altitudes, ordinary jets are the better choice. 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. Please consider starting a new thread rather than reviving this one. My 'plane science' is more advanced than my 'rocket science' (career mode) because I got tired of seeing all the high-altitude missions I had on the books and wanted to finish them. In the game, players direct a nascent space program, staffed and crewed by green humanoid aliens known as "Kerbals". Of course, this thing has very limited range, speed and acceleration because of the extra weight. First off as of .15.1 intakes don't do anything. Grichmann's answer has been the most reliable way I've found to complete these missions. Slap that behind a plane you'll be able to go beyond 20km without any trouble. Now lets combine these two indicators: The best performance your engine can achieve is when you have an optimal amount of Air Flow (obviously) but also the MAXIMUM amount of Air Intake. Best way to get down into thicker air and land is to perform what dogfighters called a 'Split-S'. Unfortunately, most space plane designs are impossible (or at the very least impractical) at your current tech level. 1.) a screenshot of kerbal space program 2. by: lord bird. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. I don't have the numbers handy, but you can expect something like 400m/s at 15km. Due to the lower air pressure at higher altitudes its thrust output decreases accordingly. Since gravity is effectively lower, they don't need as much wing area to maintain altitude-- which, in turn, means less drag, which makes for more efficient flight. Here's Mr. Manley using it in his tutorial: @Pvt.Grichmann: I think it's at specific locations on Kerbin, not just anywhere above 18km. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. Alternatively, you can assign the afterburner toggle (labelled "switch mode") to an action group if you wish to activate it with a hotkey. Highest and fastest possible is best. Range with this method is pretty short due to drag. Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. The X-37 is operated by the United States Space Force for orbital spaceflight missions intended to demonstrate reusable space technologies. Be sure to have enough intakes (I think maximum efficiency in stock is 1 ramjet intake per ~2 tons of plane, though that is aesthetically ridiculous), and if you're still running short of intake air, you can dip down a bit to speed up and get to denser air. Download (104.45 MiB) License: CC BY-NC-SA 4.0 Game Version: 1.8.1 Downloads: 371,115 Author: blackheart612 Mod Website: Forum Thread Support this mod: Donate Followers: 626 Outdated Mod This mod is not known to work with the latest version of Kerbal Space Program. If it's above the cross-hairs, you need a little less. Why do many companies reject expired SSL certificates as bugs in bug bounties? To avoid running out of fuel altogether, I have a second plane with small tanks (no oxidizer) attached directly to the jet engines, and the rockets attached behind the fuselage, which is entirely oxidized tanks. Really. high-2 A Screenshot of Kerbal Space Program There is a very close tolerance to the two speeds. air) that high up. For all your gaming related, space exploration needs. It seems to be based on the General Electric F-404 Afterburning Turbofan, which shares the same name and maximum thrust (85 kN dry). It is designed to aid in player-controlled flight on generic (space)plane, providing a soft layer between user joystick\keyboard input and control surface outputs. You need to do it with what you've got. high-1 A Screenshot of Kerbal Space Program By: miklkit This is the current version. - Inside the atmosphere works the same way, except you need to be on an suborbital trajectory. The longest flight got them down to a little more than half full. I only seem to be able to make planes that can fly a bit below that altitude and then temporary rise to it. Valve Corporation. So the faster you go the higher you can fly where there is less drag. Clear editor. So now to come to an end: from my experience I'd say for a medium sized aircraft it is best to fly between 12-13 km. ksp high altitude plane. Listen to this guy, don't go much farther above 15000 with high altitude engines. - Insane lift to weight didn't help. As said above, the Wheesley is specifically designed as a low altitude engine. Most SSTO space planes would be able to accomplish this easily. How do I align things in the following tabular environment? To get higher with the low tech jet engines, you need rocket assist. Or about the same speed but 1000 m higher. Sustained flight at over 20km requires at a minimum the Panther in Afterburning mode. The Rapier, for example, works great as a high-altitude engine, precisely because it can go so fast. If drag were the only concern, at any given altitude the slower you go, the less fuel you need: the work done by drag over a distance grows linearly with speed (the force grows quadratically with speed, but the time falls linearly). I started by attaching two LV-909 rocket engines to a regular low-atmosphere plane: In this save, I don't have custom action groups yet, so I'm using the RCS control to toggle between jet and rocket modes. Also, Valley and Theomon fly to different corners of Kerbin and three mapping satellites are launched. Subscribe - http://www.youtube.com/c/MikeAben?sub-confirmation=1 Patreon - https://www.patreon.com/MikeAbenPatreon supporters receive early, ad-free, access to videos, kOS and craft files, and more. Discord - https://discord.gg/HTvT7dZ Making Space Home Playlist - https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLB3Ia8aQsDKhqoFyoZ4d33MG7rS9KmDm_0:00 - Designing the Dudley Mk16:42 - Test Flights \u0026 Iterating13:45 - Col. Valley take the Seaplane to the Northern Ice Shelf19:30 - Launch \u0026 Insertion of the Maxwell Vb21:04 - Col. Theomon \u0026 Orlin Visit the Badlands in the Panther24:20 - Launch \u0026 Ejection of the Maxwell VI26:34 - Designing the SENTINEL 129:47 - Launch \u0026 Insertion of the Maxwell VIIFull List of Mods: Aviation Lights Chatterer Community Tech Tree Crew R\u0026R Croud Sourced Science Contract Configurator Contract Packs: Bases and Stations Reborn CommNet Relays Exploration Plus Field Research Kerbal Academy Tourism Plus Contracts Window+ Decoupler Shroud Easy Vessel Switch Kerbal Alarm Clock Kerbal Attachment System Kerbal Construction Time Kerbal Engineer Redux Kerbal Inventory System Kerbalism kOS KRASH Maneuver Node Evolved Navball Alignment Indicator Near Future Aeronautics Near Future Construction Near Future Electrical Near Future Propulsion Near Future Solar Near Future Spacecraft Persistent Rotation Rational Resources RCS Build Aid Continued Restock Restock+ SCANsat Scrapyard SMART Parts Stage Recovery Stockalike Station Parts Expansion Redux TAC Fuel Balancer Texture Replacer Trajectories Transfer Window Planner Universal Storage 2 Unkerballed Start Waypoint Manager Is it correct to use "the" before "materials used in making buildings are"? A destructible memorial to the old Mk. What altitude and speed should I go? I also added a parachute and decoupler since I find it too hard to correctly land this thing yet ;-) I managed to land in the water once, though. Note that you need to activate the afterburner ("Wet Mode") manually. I would like to know which altitude I have to maintain for my experiments. No, I think it's correct, unless I've got a brain fart going, here. as a rule of thumb they all lose thrust at higher altitudes and at high velocities. With only panthers unlocked I might add. 3x06: I design a new, high altitude, jet to collect high atmospheric science. : : . If your using NEAR/FAR, once you get high and fast, kill the engine and glide to save fuel. However, it seems as if your delta wing has has more area, might that be it? I have enough patience to do the slow flying, but is it horribly inefficient? So if you replace the turbos with basic jets, you will have more thrust from the ground up, and your vessel will weigh slightly less. Yes, although they have only been flown with nearly full tanks. Designing a High Altitude Jet | KSP: Making Space Home Mike Aben 24.8K subscribers Join Subscribe 85 Share 3.4K views 1 year ago Ep. This thread is quite old. That's just a guess, though-- perhaps someone more familiar with FAR could weigh in.). Let me share what I know about jet engines, speed, and efficiency. Right now, my big, fat plane has trouble breaking 10 km altitude and 200 m/s forward speed (largely due to its payload). All other versions are slower and lower and unstable in turns. Kerbal Space Program Jool Landing Youtube. Put a couple of radial mount parachutes just above the com and add a reaction wheel. But my guess is that these same general principles would probably apply to FAR, and that all that would change would be the numbers involved. Something that I think has become less clear since someone updated the wiki. 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. I decided to look into that two intakes thing, and it turns out to make 11-12 m/s difference at 19,000m with my plane. If not, please explain why, which I know you have no problem doing! Only the fuel tanks attached to rockets have any oxidiser in them. But you'll need to unlock: High Altitude Flight Which cost 300 science. Personally, I don't enjoy survey contracts on Kerbin. What are the units of measure used in Kerbal Space Program? Please consider starting a new thread rather than reviving this one. Isn't that backwards snark? I'm trying to build a high altitude plane and have found out that the rules are different. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. When added to a plane it allows tuning of the controls vs speed/altitude/G load/other factors. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. Because when your engine has to take in air forcefully it automatically means there isn't enough surrounding your engine and that again means that air density and therefor air resistance must be pretty low too. Any advices for building a vehicle for this task? The benefits should be obvious. The J-404 "Panther" Afterburning Turbofan is a jet engine added in version 1.0.5. The most efficient way is, of course, to make a high altitude (or space) plane. AoA built into the wing relative to the plane body is called the angle of incidence, just to help clear up. Another problem is jet engines stealing fuel from the rockets' tanks - you may want to pump the fuel manually (requires an R&D centre upgrade) or add some pipes between them. You can post now and register later. But since when do Kerbals wait for ideal conditions? All the information you could want to know about science, including the altitudes for each celestial body, and what altitudes a given experiment works on are available at: http://wiki.kerbalspaceprogram.com/wiki/Science. Unfortunately I won't be able to test it today, but @SaintWacko's proposal sounds promising. For example, the RAPIER engine doesn't seem as the first choice as the "best" high altitude air-breathing engine but in long-distance and high-altitude challenges it is. Watch out for your SAS if you're running batteries without a jet for a long time. In my case, it brought me to 20km up at a 45-degree angle, but it is probably not optimal. Technically, any rocket engine is also a jet engine as it forms a high-speed jet of reaction mass. This way control surface max deflection can be programmed by an aircraft designer to make . Double your speed, you need twice as much fuel. You cannot paste images directly. Then it is "In Space Low over Mun.". Using very light "engine rich" planes and "reverse swooping" (building velocity at 10km then gently curving up) you can temporarily get above 20km with Wheesely and Juno. This can make it a good alternative for when you want something that can be controllable and doesn't need excessive heat shielding, but still need to be able to go incredibly fast if necessary, at the expense of increased fuel consumption. High altitude flight is efficient because the air is thinner, and therefore aircraft experience less parasitic drag. Have a plane that ditches its wings and rockets up to 18km once you reach the right point. If it's below the cross-hairs, you need a little more AoA. I tried building a plane but can't climb higher than about 11,000m (I don't have many plane parts yet, though). They always seem to lose power at about 15km, but I'm wondering if there's something I can do to fix that. i recently used a single whiplash plane and was able to maintain a stable 21-22k meter altitude. Very cool. You can halve the drag by climbing a bit less than 3500m. Your link has been automatically embedded. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. Powered by Invision Community, Thanks, I'll go try to stuff a few extra turbojets and intakes on my plane, I was generally under the impression that basic jets were mostly deadweight on high-performance aircraft: [] at hypersonic velocities. Also, jets eat fuel at pounds-per-minute -- if you cover twice as much ground in the same time, your plane will be more efficient. Thats my problem right now. I followed a similar strategy. As you found out, it basically konks out at 15km. The second, Wet mode, uses the afterburner to produce thrust almost equal to the J-X4 "Whiplash" Turbo Ramjet Engine, but at a considerably reduced fuel efficiency. Delta-V is the velocity change necessary to perform orbital maneuvers. A jet engine from KSP 0.18 A jet engine is an air-breathing engine which uses onboard liquid fuel and combusts it with the oxygen drawn from the atmosphere. It is somewhat slow but very steady in flight. You could try combining the two. The drag differential is because your long-wing layout is using a bunch of struts, and the reason your delta-wing has a higher ceiling is because it has more wing area to provide lift. I've since shaved that down more but that was by going even higher and even faster). I didn't succeed with his design, though; I always ended up having somehow unstable airplanes. its rather flat but its a solid surface. Stack Exchange network consists of 181 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers. Or try using SRBs instead. Building a High Altitude Jet | Stream pt. I recommend using a solid rocket booster (or 2 or 5) to you get you the altitude and then launch a small rocket powered plane. TLDR: You need parts you don't have to make a plane that flies that high. Will post my results. One of my planes is small and agile, and can easily enough glide to a safe landing even if the rockets consume all the fuel. Maneuver node plans don't take drag into account, so you'll have to overshoot quite a bit to compensate. Paste as plain text instead, If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Or it can supercruise at three times the speed of an equivalent Wheesley jet (with nearly equal fuel efficiency) at 15,000 m altitude. "Whiplash" Turbojet. I also set it to enable the cockpit's reaction wheels to improve control at high altitude, and close air intakes to reduce drag. Hello there. As high and fast as you can go without engine flameout: preferably ~2000 m/s at 25-30 km (and yes, that's almost orbital velocity). 3x06: I design a new, high altitude, jet to collect high. At about 400-500m/s (~15km), the two engines are even. Once you're at that regime, you should be able to cover huge distances on tiny amounts of fuel. This causes the body of your plane to generate additional drag. I'm going to try adding a small solid fuel rocket engine toned down to get the initial height then dump it, as well as check into that high end gear mentioned. I've added more engines, more intakes to no avail. How can I make money in the new career mode? Note that KSP planes get one substantial speed benefit that's much more pronounced than IRL aircraft, due to the freakishly small planet sizes: they're actually flying at a large fraction of orbital velocity. I don't have any exact numbers for you, but you can right-click an engine in flight and it will show both current and optimal airflow, which should hopefully let you work out the best altitude. (Actually, four ways: but balloons aren't in the stock game) Lifting surfaces are great but they lose effectiveness just as fast with altitude as drag falls. Content titles and body; Content titles only Thrust means that slower-is-better no longer applies: now, slower means less drag but more gravity, so there's a tradeoff (which I'm not going to carefully calculate for you, because it's hard). This page was last edited on 22 December 2019, at 20:54. This thread is quite old. Even if the air is thin, you can still put out plenty of power if you are shoving enough in with raw speed. Originally posted by lord bird: yep thats right jool has a surface. Note that keeping the plane weight low is critical, only carry a very small amount of fuel. If the wings are flat and your plane steadily loses altitude in level flight at a given speed (as most designs will by default), it means you either need to pitch up slightly, increasing the angle of attack and keeping your vertical velocity at 0 by flying up slightly to compensate for the pull of gravity that lift isn't compensating for. Clear editor. This tutorial will cover designing and flying a plane that can soar at high altitudes! 1 Pod outside the level 3 VAB. So I've created those two planes, both with weasley turbofan engine: This is your problem-- as folks have pointed out, it's not a high-altitude engine. Trying to do something without the right part is long and difficult path. Challenges You cannot paste images directly. It is boosted into space by a launch vehicle, then re-enters Earth's atmosphere and lands as a spaceplane. Your previous content has been restored. KSP Quick Guides: High Altitude Design and Flying - Stock v.23 Stoober AK 3.32K subscribers Subscribe 21K views 8 years ago This tutorial will cover designing and flying a plane that can soar. As high and fast as you can go without engine flameout: preferably ~2000 m/s at 25-30 km (and yes, that's almost orbital velocity). Jets drop thrust at higher altitude and speed, but also drop . - "In Space Low" means your craft is inside the "Space Border" altitude and in an orbital path. Keep in mind that wheesley engine's performance decreases significantly as the altitude increases. Thanks, I'll go try to stuff a few extra turbojets and intakes on my plane Do you know how many intakes/turbojet are needed to run in the regime you described? Though I'm still working on learning to be better at space planes. This works, but it's not optimal. Secondly don't think of engines working better at different altitudes, think of them working better with different air intake quantities. I don't have that other stuff yet. Is it suspicious or odd to stand by the gate of a GA airport watching the planes? Whiplash is the engine you would want to use on a plane meant to go 20km. So if you want to make a plane go as fast as possible, you want to minimise both angle of attack and angle of incidence necessary to sustain level flight at your target speed and altitude. What am I doing wrong here in the PlotLegends specification. Orbiting is the most fun one: the higher the orbit, the less speed you need to maintain to stay in orbit, *and* the less air there is, so that's a double-whammy in terms of reducing fuel consumption. Upload or insert images from URL. Cheers again fellas. I got this game so I could over-engineer rockets, so I mostly ignore the airplanes. I didn't try for 20000m as it probably wouldn't do well. Contents 1 Usage 2 Construction 3 Categories 3.1 Airplane 3.2 Seaplane 3.3 Spaceplane 3.4 VTOL 3.5 Glider 3.6 Mothership 4 Operation 4.1 Flight records 5 Notes Usage Since turbos are almost always enough to get you off the ground and up to altitude, I usually just do straight turbojets (with some RAPIERs for SSTO spaceplanes); the minute amount of fuel saved during the ascent isn't worth lugging those superfluous engines around at the hypersonic regime. Build a plane or rocket for Kerbal high altitudes, We've added a "Necessary cookies only" option to the cookie consent popup, Screenshot of the Week #85 [Submissions Closed - Vote Now!]. Chapter 4. Redoing the align environment with a specific formatting, Trying to understand how to get this basic Fourier Series. The ideal case for optimally efficient flight (which is what you want if you're trying to maximize cruise altitude) is when your wings are mounted to the body, pitched up just enough that when cruising in level flight, the body of the aircraft is pointing perfectly . Running the 60U engine at about 40U seems to give me a good balance between reduced drag and air intake. I'd almost expect it to work better in stock since infini-gliders can be done. The thrust of jets (turbo or otherwise) depends on airspeed: basics deliver more thrust at low speeds, while turbojets only really come into their own when you fly very fast (which also means flying very high, 20km and over). This means that the only thing that decides wheter your engines run efficient is determined by how much thrust they produce (opt. It only takes a minute to sign up. You can spin around the whole world on just fumes. You cannot paste images directly. Check out the website and try the game out for yourself :Dhttps://kerbalspaceprogram.com/ So long as there's only one high-altitude measurement to take, you should be able to complete a whole set of 3-4 in one flight. If it's above the cross-hairs, you need a little less. Or you need to put a little bit of angle of incidence in your wings, which will reduce drag since you don't have to pitch the entire plane up, but will be stuck at a fixed angle meaning you'll have to pitch up or down anyway during certain phases of the flight that the plane isn't optimised for. Arqade is a question and answer site for passionate videogamers on all platforms. . By climbing, you reduce drag, exponentially with altitude. Basically there are two things that limit your maximum speed: thrust and speed of sound and with that your maximum altitude. I currently have a contract where I'm asked to take crew reports at certain spots on Kerbal at an altitude of 18,000m. Upload or insert images from URL. In the main KSP settings menu you should set the default throttle to 1.0 (technically the above mechjeb setting winds up restoring the default throttle, so it needs to be 1.0) In the attitude adjustment menu make sure you are using the "better controller" Whack the 45 degree phase margin button Whack the restore all other defaults button

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